i just don't think immigration is on the top five list in the average american today. just judging -- >> but you weren't asking me about the average american. you were asking me about latinos. >> that's true. but in terms of it coming up as a major issue, i don't think it will come up. and number two, i feel if you're playing pure politics, like it or not, reality is the president and the democratic party will get credit for the immigration reform and therefore further bolster the hispanic vote as opposed to republicans that would go along as the minority. >> maybe indeed it's because of chris matthews and the questions he was throwing at the president. >> that's a different issue. i read the transcript. i work with chris as everybody knows at cnbc. i like chris. but to pretend that he's a journalist, per say, i think that's kind of artificial. he's a failed democratic candidate for congress. he's talked about running for senate. he was the chief of staff of the speaker of the house, chipp3 o'neill. mr. democrat. he's been a democrat his whole life. it was more of a fa